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- <text id=93TT1889>
- <title>
- June 14, 1993: Mandela And De Klerk Speak Out
- </title>
- <history>
- TIME--The Weekly Newsmagazine--1993
- Jun. 14, 1993 The Pill That Changes Everything
- </history>
- <article>
- <source>Time Magazine</source>
- <hdr>
- SOUTH AFRICA, Page 36
- Mandela And De Klerk Speak Out
- </hdr>
- <body>
- <p>In exclusive interviews, South Africa's black and white leaders
- both profess optimism about a multiracial future
- </p>
- <p>Nelson Mandela
- </p>
- <p> NELSON MANDELA
- </p>
- <p> Q. How important a milestone is the setting of the election
- date?
- </p>
- <p> A. This decision to have an election by April 27 introduces
- an element of irreversibility. It is a landmark.
- </p>
- <p> Q. Is it a safe assumption that you will be the next President
- of South Africa?
- </p>
- <p> A. (Chuckling) Some of the young men would not agree with you
- because they all want to be President. The opinion polls say
- that if elections were held today, the A.N.C. would probably
- win by an outright majority. It is then for the A.N.C. to decide
- who should be President. We have many dynamic people, and I
- would be prepared to serve under them.
- </p>
- <p> Q. Do you believe De Klerk's National Party will abide by the
- results of the election?
- </p>
- <p> A. I have no reason to doubt they are negotiating in good faith.
- But of course their concept of democracy is different from yours
- and mine. We have already encountered this problem in their
- concept of power sharing, which to them means the party that
- loses the elections should continue to govern. Now we have moved
- them away from that, and they are coming to accept our concept
- of a government of national unity which is based on majority
- rule. We are saying all political parties with a substantial
- following should be included in government, so we can face problems
- together.
- </p>
- <p> Q. But in the end, won't their bottom line be permanent power
- sharing?
- </p>
- <p> A. My view is that they are moving away from that bottom line.
- </p>
- <p> Q. Can you deliver on people's expectations, or is the damage
- of apartheid too deep?
- </p>
- <p> A. Forty years of apartheid have been like 40 years of war.
- Our economy and our social life have been completely devastated,
- in some respects beyond repair. That was the situation in Europe
- after the last World War. What the Western world did was to
- mobilize their resources and introduce Marshall Plan aid to
- ensure that the countries of Europe devastated by the war recovered.
- What we expect--and this is a matter which I'm going to raise
- with President Clinton--is that the Western world, led by
- the U.S., should ensure that massive measures of assistance
- are given to the people of South Africa so we can address their
- expectations.
- </p>
- <p> Q. What do you say to your supporters who don't want to share
- power with former practitioners of apartheid?
- </p>
- <p> A. Last week I met the executive committee of the African National
- Congress Youth League, which has been vocal in criticizing the
- government of national unity. Quite understandably, they say,
- "These are the people who have been oppressing us since 1948.
- We are on the verge of overthrowing apartheid and their government,
- and now you say we must work with these people." That is perfectly
- reasonable. But we discussed the matter at length, and at the
- end of that meeting they accepted that the strategy of a government
- of national unity is a correct one.
- </p>
- <p> Q. And what about those on the right who fear and might resist
- black majority rule?
- </p>
- <p> A. In the referendum last year, the right wing polled no less
- than 800,000 votes. In addition, they have got a substantial
- section of the civil service, the police force, the army, which
- support them. Now they have said if the A.N.C. wins the elections
- and establishes the government, they will take up arms. That
- is the threat facing us. It's a serious threat, but we aren't
- overly concerned. We have to reorganize the police force and
- make sure it is capable of defending democracy.
- </p>
- <p> Q. Can you think of any precedent for a minority that has held
- power for centuries and surrendered it peacefully?
- </p>
- <p> A. We are now making joint decisions with that minority. They
- said they would never talk with the A.N.C., and they fought
- almost every election on that basis. We have made them sit down
- and talk to us. We are now together planning the future South
- Africa. They have had to unban the A.N.C., to lift the state
- of emergency, to allow a climate of free political activity,
- which they had not allowed for more than 40 years. They have
- released political prisoners, allowed political exiles to return
- to the country, amended and even repealed repressive legislation,
- and agreed on the installation of a transitional executive council.
- And now they are agreeing with us on a date for an election
- in the country.
- </p>
- <p> Q. Why have they cooperated?
- </p>
- <p> A. I think they realized that not only were the overwhelming
- majority of South Africans prepared to fight for the right to
- run their lives, but the whole international community was against
- South Africa.
- </p>
- <p> Q. So, did sanctions work?
- </p>
- <p> A. Oh, there is no doubt.
- </p>
- <p> Q. Should sanctions now be lifted?
- </p>
- <p> A. We have come to the verge of calling them off. Our official
- policy was that until free and fair elections were held, we
- would maintain sanctions. But the problems facing our country--7 million people unemployed, rocketing crime, the violence
- and so on--has made us revise our time frame. If the transitional
- executive council is installed and if an election date is set,
- we would call off sanctions.
- </p>
- <p> Q. Three and a half years ago, you were still under arrest.
- Now you're engaged in the process of rebuilding the country.
- Did you ever think this was going to happen in your lifetime?
- </p>
- <p> A. There were definitely moments when I was not so certain this
- day would come. But as you know, I did send a message that was
- read by my daughter at a public meeting attended by Archbishop
- Tutu where I said, "I will return." So that perception was always
- there. But that doesn't mean there were not moments when I doubted
- whether this moment would come. But the strength of the struggle
- in the country and the support of the international community
- has always been powerful, and that kept our morale very high,
- and it made us feel that the forces of change were too powerful
- to be ignored by the government.
- </p>
- <p> Q. Many have commented about your lack of bitterness. How could
- you put the past behind you?
- </p>
- <p> A. Perhaps if I was idle and did not have a job to do, I would
- be as bitter as others. But because I have been given a job
- to do, I have not had time to think about the cruel experiences
- I've had. I'm not unique. Others have every reason to be more
- bitter than I. There are countless people who went to jail and
- aren't bitter at all, because they can see that their sacrifices
- were not in vain, and the ideas for which we lived and sacrificed
- are about to come to fruition. And that removes the bitterness
- from their hearts.
- </p>
-
- </body>
- </article>
- </text>
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